RE: problem with CONDUIT ETA/GFS since 4 Jan 2005

 I guess if the data comes in faster, then it's a fair trade off.


-----Original Message-----
From: address@hidden
To: Robert Mullenax
Cc: 'Mike Leuthold '; 'address@hidden ';
address@hidden
Sent: 1/10/2005 3:13 PM
Subject: Re: problem with CONDUIT ETA/GFS since 4 Jan 2005


All,

Apparently these emails were not distributed to the entire conduit list.

Here's what's going on.

In a Jan 5 email from Steve Chiswell to Jerry, Me and support-conduit:

 >Jerry,
 >
 >Yesterday at 1830Z we implemented a parallel queueing scheme at the
 >NWS that we hope will improve the timeliness of data being ingected
into
 >the CONDUIT data stream. Any feedback you can provide on how
 >this affects your reception would be greatly appreciated.
 >
 >Since data will be inserted in parallel, you will notice that multiple
 >model runds and forecast times will probably be interspersed where
 >previously they had been serialized.
 >
 >I watched the 00Z GFS last night, and the posting gap between f084 and
 >f132 was matched on the FTP server at 0422Z and later at 0509Z, the
 >other grids were posted to the NWS servers, so all appears to be
 >behaving correctly on this end.
 >
 >Steve Chiswell
 >Unidata User Support
 >

An email from Me to Steve last Friday (Jan 7)

> Steve,
> 
> Since the parallel queueing scheme was implemented, I have noticed two
> things, both are problematic.
> 
> 1) The lag goes way up since so much more data is being inserted into
> the queue in a shorter amount of time. I was getting lag times of
3000-4000
> seconds in peak gfs times.  I moved my ldm queue on f5 to a faster
disk, and
> that helped, but it's still getting up to 300-400 seconds.
> 
> 2) The biggest problem I see, is that now it takes MUCH longer for the
> early hours of a forecast run to complete.  Most of my model plotting
> scripts and all of our real-time mesoscale modelling efforts here
> take advantage of the fact that an entire model run doesn't need to be
> complete before we can start.  Since the parallel queueing was
enabled,
> the 00 hour forecast of the eta model for example, takes over an hour
> to get here, where previously it was taking maybe 5 minutes.
> 
> If this is how it's going to be, I'd much prefer the old serial
ingest,
> or maybe some kind of blend, so the first 12 hours or so (or 48 or 
> whatever) of a model run can get priority. 
> 
> It really hurts us to have the 00 hour forecast complete around the 
> same time as the later forecasts, even if the entire model run gets 
> in faster as a result.
> 
> For what it's worth.
> 
> Pete
> 

Steve's reply on Friday [again to me, Jerry and support-conduit]

 >Pete,
 >
 >In pushing the queing lag time from the NWS computer queueing the data
 >to the NWS computer doing the data insertion, some of the latency is
 >now in the LDM queue as the volume you are receiving is increased
 >into a shorted time window- whereas before it was all in the
insertion.
 >
 >I agree that the parallel insertion is at some expense of the early
 >files since the slug of insertion starts slowing that down and
 >we'll have to see if we can optimize the insertion.
 >
 >Steve Chiswell
 >Unidata User Support

FYI.

Pete




In a previous message to me, you wrote: 

 > Yes.  We see the same problem.
 >
 >-----Original Message-----
 >From: address@hidden
 >To: address@hidden
 >Sent: 1/10/2005 2:41 PM
 >Subject: problem with CONDUIT ETA/GFS since 4 Jan 2005
 >
 >Hello,
 >      As of 4 Jan 2005, I've noticed that the model products are being
 >sent out in a mixed up time sequence.  Previously, all the F000 fields
 >were sent, then F003, and so on.  Now, the times are all mixed up with
 >F000 fields still coming in even though the F072 fields have just
 >started.  
 >In the past, by T+2.5 hours, the ETA212 was up to having at least F048
 >finished, thus I was able to start a local WRF run.  Now, I have to
wait
 >much longer for F048 to complete, delaying substantially the start of
my
 >real time WRF runs.  Is any one else seeing this sort of problem?
 >
 >Thanks.
 >Mike
 >
 >
 >Below is sample:
 >
 >Jan 10 20:32:47 pqutil:    23958 20050110203228.114 CONDUIT 078
 
>/afs/.nwstg.nws.noaa.gov/ftp/SL.us008001/ST.opnl/MT.nam_CY.18/RD.200501
1
 >0/PT.grid_DF.gr1/fh.0060_tl.press_gr.awip3d
 >!grib/ncep/ETA_84/#212/200501101800/F060/VVEL/350_mb! 000078
 >Jan 10 20:32:48 pqutil:    23958 20050110203243.766 CONDUIT 169
 
>/afs/.nwstg.nws.noaa.gov/ftp/SL.us008001/ST.opnl/MT.nam_CY.18/RD.200501
1
 >0/PT.grid_DF.gr1/fh.0045_tl.press_gr.awip3d
 >!grib/ncep/ETA_84/#212/200501101800/F045/TMP/225_mb! 000169
 >Jan 10 20:32:48 pqutil:    26942 20050110203239.440 CONDUIT 300
 
>/afs/.nwstg.nws.noaa.gov/ftp/SL.us008001/ST.opnl/MT.nam_CY.18/RD.200501
1
 >0/PT.grid_DF.gr1/fh.0024_tl.press_gr.awip3d
 >!grib/ncep/ETA_84/#212/200501101800/F024/SPFH/575_mb! 000300
 >
 >
 >--
 >Mike Leuthold
 >Atmospheric Sciences/Institute of Atmospheric Physics
 >University of Arizona
 >address@hidden
 >520-621-2863
 >
 >"Is there some difference between the despotism of the monarch and 
 > the despotism of the multitude?"
 >
 >Edmund Burke


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